Intelligent Reasoning

Promoting, advancing and defending Intelligent Design via data, logic and Intelligent Reasoning and exposing the alleged theory of evolution as the nonsense it is. I also educate evotards about ID and the alleged theory of evolution one tard at a time and sometimes in groups

Thursday, November 04, 2010

"Panspermia Past and Present"- OoL looking good for ID

- Astrophysical and Biophysical Conditions for the
Dissemination of Life in Space
:

It has been known for a long while that random chemical interactions cannot produce the genetic information of the organisms we currently see on Earth (Argyle 1977, Hoyle 1980, Hart 1982, Barrow and Tipler 1986, Wesson 1990). For example, in a model of the prebiotic Earth with an appropriate complement of amino acids, random molecular interactions over a period of 500 x 106 yr would produce only about 194 bits of information (Argyle 1977). This is far short of the 1.2 x 105 bits in a typical virus, and tiny compared to the 6 x 106 bits in a bacterium like E. Coli. The low gain in information I from N trials is because the two things are related by I = log2 N . There are in principle two ways to circumvent this problem. One is that life in fact evolved solely on the Earth, but by some non-random, directed molecular process. The other is that life evolved on the Earth and other planets because they were seeded by biological molecules which already had a large information content. Both of these hypotheses have objections; but in view of the near-inevitability of this process shown above, the second appears to be the more plausible.

16 Comments:

  • At 11:20 PM, Blogger Rich Hughes said…

    Oh noes! spontaneous generation without iteration is unlikely!!!111one.

     
  • At 7:16 AM, Blogger Joe G said…

    Oh noes- Richtard still doesn't have any positive evidence for hios position so all he can do is spew more nonsense...

     
  • At 7:33 AM, Blogger Joe G said…

    And iteration without evidence is nonsense...

    Geez Richtard thinks there is some magical ratchet that was used to create life and its diversity...

     
  • At 9:36 AM, Blogger Rich Hughes said…

    "And iteration without evidence is nonsense..."


    Fossil record, anyone? Geez, we can see changes happening today. The fact we're not clones of our parents should give you a clue.

     
  • At 9:45 AM, Blogger Joe G said…

    Richtard:
    Fossil record, anyone?

    You fucking moron we are talking aout the origin of living organisms.

    The fossil record doesn't say anything about any mechanism and no one knows how it was formed.

     
  • At 9:59 AM, Blogger Rich Hughes said…

    "You fucking moron we are talking aout the origin of living organisms."

    And do you think the origional proto-life was what is being described above?

     
  • At 10:04 AM, Blogger Joe G said…

    Richtard:
    And do you think the origional proto-life was what is being described above?

    The paper talks about panspermia because the origin of living organisms did not occur on this planet.

     
  • At 10:12 AM, Blogger Rich Hughes said…

    "The paper talks about panspermia because the origin of living organisms did not occur on this planet."

    Beg the question much?

     
  • At 3:40 PM, Blogger OM said…

    Joe,
    You might be interested in this

    http://pandasthumb.org/archives/2010/11/workshop-on-ori.html#more

    you can ask questions to the experts and tell them where they've been going wrong.

    Here's a snippet of the program:

    1:05 pm – 1:30 pm EST
    Replaying the Tape of Life: The Potential of Evolution as a Predictive Science
    Lynn Rothschild
    NASA Ames Research Center

    1:30 pm – 1:50 pm EST
    CO and the Evolution of Methanogenesis
    Greg Ferry
    Pennsylvania State University

    1:50 pm – 2:10 pm EST
    Iron-Sulfur Enzyme Evolution
    John Peters
    Montana State University

    2:10 pm – 2:30 pm EST
    Metals, Sulfide and Phosphate Bring Wet Rocky Worlds to Life
    Mike Russell
    NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory

    2:30 pm – 2:50 pm EST
    Iron-Sulfur Mineral Based Prebiotic Chemistry
    Robert Szilagyi
    Montana State University

    See you there!

     
  • At 4:32 PM, Blogger Joe G said…

    "The paper talks about panspermia because the origin of living organisms did not occur on this planet."

    Rich:
    Beg the question much?

    Not when the paper is based on scientific data, evidence, observations and experiences.

     
  • At 5:21 PM, Blogger Rich Hughes said…

    No, you've assumed your premise in the question. Clearly. The paper does no such thing.

     
  • At 5:30 PM, Blogger Joe G said…

    Rich:
    No, you've assumed your premise in the question.

    What question?

     
  • At 5:40 PM, Blogger Rich Hughes said…

    Well teh overarching question would be how panspermia seeded the planet. This assumes, a-priori that it was panspermia. And now a few noted for the dim-witted.

    This would push abiogenesis back in time, when there where even less probabilistic resources available.

    The paper is largely concerned with planetry seeding via random and undirected fragments of a world that once contained life. This is NOT ID.

    The math for creating ex-nilho a virus doesn't comport to any abiogenesis conjecture that's out there. It is a lazy rehash of 747/Junkyard/Tornado.

     
  • At 5:45 PM, Blogger Joe G said…

    Rich:
    Well teh overarching question would be how panspermia seeded the planet. This assumes, a-priori that it was panspermia.

    Did you read the paper?

    There isn't any evidence living organisms appeared here via blind, undirected chemical processes.

    Rich:
    This would push abiogenesis back in time, when there where even less probabilistic resources available.

    In the design scenario the probabilistic resources are 1.

    In your scenario no one knows what resources are even required.

    Rich:
    The paper is largely concerned with planetry seeding via random and undirected fragments of a world that once contained life. This is NOT ID.

    Right- ID is only concerned with the origins.

    Rich:
    The math for creating ex-nilho a virus doesn't comport to any abiogenesis conjecture that's out there.

    All abiogenesis conjectures are based on wishful thinking and nothing more.

     
  • At 7:26 PM, Blogger OM said…

    Joe
    In the design scenario the probabilistic resources are 1.

    How do you work that out then?

    How many humans have you observed causing the origin of life on planet Earth millions of years ago?

    I can't think of any other designer we know about or have any evidence for that could potentially do such a thing.

    Can you think of one Joe?

     
  • At 8:30 AM, Blogger Joe G said…

    In the design scenario the probabilistic resources are 1.

    OM:
    How do you work that out then?

    Work what out?

    OM:
    How many humans have you observed causing the origin of life on planet Earth millions of years ago?

    What does that have to do with anything?

    I take it you don't understand science.

    OM:
    I can't think of any other designer we know about or have any evidence for that could potentially do such a thing.

    The evidence is all around you.

     

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